An Interview with the former Governor of New Mexico, Gary Johnson
By Mark Pedersen (Missouri)
10-07-2010
Mark: Please give me your name and where you are from.
Gary: Gary Johnson. I'm the former Governor of New Mexico from 1995 to 2002. Currently I reside in Taos, New Mexico, which is... as good a skiing as any place on the planet and that's why I'm there.
Mark: Why don't you continue with what you were saying earlier (off camera).
Gary: My brother is a cardiothoracic surgeon. Arguably he's one of the leading authorities on esophageal cancer nationwide. He has a theory that all of what we do in medicine...perhaps...perhaps... it has no positive or negative affect when it come to cancer treatment.
I know in my own life that, a...I know that in all of our lives, we have ups and downs. We get to feeling bad. In my life, I start looking at what I'm eating, I start looking at the exercise that I'm engaged in. I start looking at the stress that I'm under. So I look for ways to reduce the stress. I look for ways to change my diet. I look to, most cases, to exercise more. So when it comes to cannabis use and cancer, I think what it probably creates is a new awareness that people have of their bodies and what they are going through. And they end up making adjustments that they should be making regarding their lifestyle. And that often times positively impacts the cancer that they have.
You go in for ...we all know people who go in for checkups and find themselves with cancer. They undergo invasive chemotherapy for that cancer. Some survive and some don't. But if they never went in for the checkup in the first place, and found themselves feeling bad, ...now I get back to this whole notion of a self-diagnosis...things we all end up doing for ourselves, that actually right us all the time.
Do our bodies go in and out of cancer? I have a sense that they do. But if we correct our habits, we'll naturally combat those cancers. I think that marijuana for a lot of people may bring about that awareness that maybe they wouldn't have had otherwise.
Mark: The remarkable thing that we are discovering more and more is that we do have an endocannabinoid system and the understanding of that has opened a lot of doors in the way of medical treatments and I guess that's the biggest thing that I can see personally...that I want to see happen is for us to have access to the kinds of medications, holistic medicines that could possibly benefit people.
The endocannabinoid system refers to neuromodulatory lipids and their receptors that are within the body of every mammal, that modulate appetite, pain sensation, mood and memory. Further research has indicated that the endocannabinoid system plays an important role in preventing a wide range of autoimmune diseases, such as Multiple Sclerosis, Parkinson's, Epilepsy, and many forms of cancer .
It has been said by many that the plant-based cannabinoids that are found in cannabis fulfill the role of being a supplement to this vital internal system.
Mark: If we're willing to give toxic dangerous drugs to people who are chronically and terminally ill...already...why can we not give them something that is non-toxic, something that will not kill them...why not that?
Gary: ...And you would find no disagreement here. You would find complete support of that notion. We're often times ingesting poisons to kill off cancers. Sometimes successful, often times not. But to have alternatives...yea, these are end of life issues for a lot of people.
Mark: I've been seeing you a lot here in the Midwest, lately. How come?
Gary: I have formed a 501c4. "Our America Initiative". I'm the Honorary Chairman. It's an advocacy committee which allows me to raise money to speak out on the issues of the day.
Since the launch of "Our America Initiative" in 2009, Johnson has appeared on the Hannity Show, FOX News, FOX Business Network, CNBC, The Colbert Report, and Real Time with Bill Maher.
Gary: I really think there is a national outrage over the fact that this nation is bankrupt. The fact that $.43 out of every dollar that we're spending is borrowed. The fact that this country is potentially at the point of financial collapse.
If we don't right the financial ship, I think we may all be left with nothing. If we right the financial ship, I think that we could have something significant. The United States of America, the Constitution, which guarantees liberty and freedom, and of course, the personal responsibility that goes along with that.
So for me, everything is a cost/benefit analysis. What are we spending and what are we getting? When you look at marijuana as the issue of what are we spending and what are we getting, half of what we are spending on law enforcement, the courts and the prisons is drug related. And what are we getting for that? We're arresting 1.8 million people a year in this country on drug related crime. I always point out that this is the population of New Mexico that gets arrested every single year.
And when you put a face to that... I get emotional over people that are being affected by the criminal justice system; that are being exposed to the criminal justice system for choices that arguably affect no one else other than the individuals involved themselves.
The choice to smoke marijuana. As long as you're smoking marijuana and not doing harm to anyone else...as long as you're smoking marijuana and not becoming impaired and getting behind the wheel of a car...kids are never going to be allowed to smoke marijuana... I advocate legalizing marijuana.
I think that 90% of the drug problem is prohibition-related. Not use related. That's not to discount the problems of use and abuse, but that ought to be the focus.
Mark: You made the statement that drug use should be treated as health issue and not a criminal issue?
Gary: I advocate the legalization marijuana. When it comes to ALL other drugs, I think that we should look at all other drugs from a harm reduction standpoint. Reducing death, disease, crime, corruption - the things we REALLY care about - the things that are actually prohibition related. So let's look at all other drugs from the standpoint of them being first a health issue rather than a criminal justice issue.
Mark: I understand that you are on the board of directors for the Students for Sensible Drug Policy.
Gary: I think that Students for Sensible Drug Policy...this event here today...I think that they are raising awareness nationwide. I really think that legalizing marijuana is close to a tipping point. I think that statistically its 2 1/2 years away from where 50% of Americans will support legalizing marijuana. And I see that as a really good thing. I see law enforcement freed up to enforce real crime against you and I. Let's stop this needless war that is ending up making criminals out of otherwise tax-paying, law-abiding citizens.
Mark: You're a Republican. Doesn't your stance on issues like cannabis...doesn't that kind of go contrary to that?
Gary: Well, if you take the universe of politicians, I might be... "it". Democrat or Republican. So you could say that Republicans are out front on this simply because I am out front on this. (chuckle) Find a Democrat that is speaking to this issue as I... The important thing is, it's really not a Republican or Democrat issue. It's really one of awareness. When it comes to marijuana and drug policy, I think citizens are way ahead of the politicians.
Mark: Thank you. I appreciate you saying that.
Mark: How do you feel about Proposition 19? That is getting a lot of press lately.
Gary: Oh, I have been to California about a dozen times to promote Proposition 19. I think that it has the potential to be the domino that would bring about rational drug policy nationwide. On the ballot in California...tax it, regulate it, control the sale of marijuana. Take the money out of marijuana.
When it comes to border violence, advocating legalizing marijuana...arguably 75% of border violence goes away because that's the estimate that most Mexican drug cartel's activity is marijuana-related.
Mark: For a medical cannabis patient, the quality of the product that they are getting is a primary issue. People are already sick. Getting what they are already using (illegally) as medicine and it's contaminated, it's poor quality...these are things that make life harder for people who are chronically and terminally ill. If cannabis were free, then we would have the opportunity to have a better quality of medicine to treat our illnesses.
Gary: I believe that. In other words, legalizing marijuana.
Mark: (nod)
Mark: You said 2 1/2 years, you believe?
Gary: I believe that statistically...right now about 45% of Americans support legalizing marijuana. That number has never been that high and that number never backtracks. Depending on how the wind is blowing, it never goes to 44 or 43. It's a growing number. It's the opposition to legalizing marijuana that is pretty soft. With just a little bit of education...that's what an event like today really should highlight more than anything else. That is, with awareness, others are going to move on this issue; move to a rational outlook on drugs and drug policy.
Mark: I was reading something about you here the other day. Bill Kauffman of the American Conservative Magazine wrote that "he (you) may take a shot at the Republican presidential nomination in 2012." He said that you were "...an antiwar, anti-Fed, pro-personal liberties, slash-government-spending candidate - in other words, a Ron Paul libertarian." Is that you?
Gary: Well, I'm a Republican. As part of the 501c4, I can't talk about running for public office lest I get crossways with my legal status. So I get to talk about issues...
...Certainly talking about the war. I have been opposed to our involvement with Iraq and Afghanistan. Afghanistan I thought, originally, was completely warranted. I thought that was a strike against Osama Bin Laden and Al-Qaeda, but they're not there anymore.
And we're now entering into our tenth year of engagement in Afghanistan. We're building roads, schools, bridges, highways and hospitals in Iraq and Afghanistan and we're borrowing $.43 out of every dollar to do this? I just think we're nation-building throughout the world when we have our own nation to build...and it needs to stop.
Mark: What is it now? Around a trillion dollars as far as the Iraqi conflict?
Gary: I'm not sure about total money spent... I know when it comes to defense spending, it's about 800 billion dollars a year. We're spending more for military spending, in the United States, than all the other nations in the world combined. And yet we are only 5% of the world's population.
So we cannot continue to be the world's policemen. And at the end of the day, the worst thing about all our involvement in Iraq and Afghanistan and our involvement around the world is that more young men and women are going to end up losing their lives as a result of our commitments that, at the end of the day, might not make a difference.
Mark: Well, with an ever growing number of our boys and girls coming back from...young men and women, I should say, coming back from Iraq and Afghanistan with serious health issues, most particularly the issue of Post Traumatic Stress Disorder. I don't know if you're familiar with...that cannabis is becoming quite the treatment for Post Traumatic Stress Disorder -
Gary: - and I would think so. Based on my own experience.
I don't drink...I don't drink but I have drank alcohol. I don't smoke marijuana but I have smoked marijuana. In my own experience, I know that there is a big difference between marijuana and alcohol. And that is that marijuana is safer than alcohol. And of course we saw that played out in Denver when five years ago Denver citizens voted to decriminalize marijuana on a campaign based on marijuana being safer than alcohol.
So when you look at Post Traumatic Stress Syndrome, from my own experience, I would think it WOULD be very helpful for individuals to have that as an option...for that malady. And I say malady...that might not be the right word.
Mark: You said around 2 1/2 years. Where do you see this country in regard to cannabis in 2 1/2 years?
Gary: Well, potentially, we'll be ahead of that curve if Prop 19 passes in California. If Proposition 19 passes, controlling, regulating, taxing the sale of marijuana... I think that could happen even sooner. But I do see this as a "states" issue. California is arguably leading the way...not arguably,...clearly leading the way with the issue on the ballot this Fall, but if it passes, it's just going to create rational drug policy in many other states. If it doesn't pass, I think it will lead to that. And again, I'll put a timeframe on that of two and a half years from now.
Mark: Apparently there are propositions similar to the one going on in California in many other states -
Gary: Yes. yes.
Mark: We're discussing that for Missouri, also.
Mark: Anything else that you would like to say to the people that are going watch this video?
Gary: Well, I would just applaud everyone for their activism on this topic.
I would ask everyone to re-double their efforts when it comes to rational discussions with individuals that don't understand the issue.
And I'd also like to put a face to the 1.8 million arrests that are out there. I was talking to a young man in Des Moines, Iowa three weeks ago was...
I think we all have this notion in this country that, really, we're not arresting people for possession. We've become more understanding. We're really arresting individuals that are selling pot and that we are going after the pushers...when in reality, nothing has changed.
And I get back to my example. Three weeks ago, I was talking with and individual in Des Moines, Iowa. He was arrested and charged with possession of one gram of marijuana with intent to distribute it to his seventeen year old daughter. He had been arrested, he was convicted, and sentenced to twenty-five years in jail for that. He had just gotten out of jail, having spent fourteen months in jail and he was going to spend ten years on probation following this. He's representative of, I think, thirty million Americans who have been subject to the criminal justice system who otherwise would be tax-paying, law-abiding citizens. Let's stop the war against ourselves.
Mark: It's been the case...I've seen it all across the country, myself, where families have been broken up. I've seen it mostly in regard to the medical use of cannabis because that is the area that I work mostly in. But I have a family in South Carolina right now where the husband has Muscular Dystrophy and the wife has Multiple Sclerosis. Through the use of cannabis, the wife, now, she's working, she's been able to go back to school...she's able to function and able to hold down her family.
The unfortunate thing is, as soon as Family Services found out about it, they came in and took their children away, destroyed their home. The children went from A's and B's (in school) down to C's and D's. Now after five years, they still can only see them through structured visits.
Gary: And, Mark, as you know and I know, and what I would like to convey to everyone watching is that there are millions of those kind of stories out there nationwide...that I would like to bring an end to.
Mark: I would like to give you a copy of this. I have a couple of things here. (Handing him the DVD), this is Len Richmond's movie, "What if Cannabis Cured Cancer". I wanted you to have a copy of that. It's an exceptionally good movie. It explains the endocannabinoid system.
I think that everyone who is in political office should be getting materials like this because it provides the science and facts of the issue rather than hearsay or what people think. This is backed up by actual science.
Gary: Thank you.
Mark: Also a copy of our magazine, Medical Cannabis Journal.
Gary: Great.
Mark: And, by the way, this interview will eventually be an article within our magazine.
Gary: Terrific!
Mark: You will be in here, (motioning to the magazine) I understand that you will be on Time4Hemp here in another couple of weeks, possibly?
Gary: (nodding) Well, I will also be on Bill Maher on the 22nd of October. Bill's going to have a show that's really going to try to focus on Prop. 19 in November. Trying to get people out to vote.
Mark: Bill and I have some similar friends. (chuckle) Very cool. Well there you go, (handing him the magazine)
Gary: Thank you.
Mark: Thank you so much for sitting for an interview with me.
Gary: Thank you.
Mark: I appreciate it very much. And I'll be following you very closely.
Gary: Alright. Good.
For more information on Gary Johnson's organization, "Our American Initiative", please visit their website at "ouramericainitiative.com".
© This article is copyrighted by Medical Cannabis Journal 10-07-2010
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I have been a registered Nurse for over 35 years. I began in medical/surgical adult care - nursing and the hospital system. Along the way, I learned about patients using cannabis. I have a Masters prepared background in medical/surgical nursing. In the early 80’s, I was a supervising nurse in a small hospital in Washington State. Our Director of Nursing was quite concerned because an elderly patient was coming in with what she called a “marijuana pill.
MCJ Interviews Mary Lynn Mathre
I have been a registered Nurse for over 35 years. I began in medical/surgical adult care - nursing and the hospital system. Along the way, I learned about patients using cannabis. I have a Masters prepared background in medical/surgical nursing. In the early 80’s, I was a supervising nurse in a small hospital in Washington State. Our Director of Nursing was quite concerned because an elderly patient was coming in with what she called a “marijuana pill.
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MCJ Interviews Mary Lynn Mathre
I have been a registered Nurse for over 35 years. I began in medical/surgical adult care - nursing and the hospital system. Along the way, I learned about patients using cannabis. I have a Masters prepared background in medical/surgical nursing. In the early 80’s, I was a supervising nurse in a small hospital in Washington State. Our Director of Nursing was quite concerned because an elderly patient was coming in with what she called a “marijuana pill.
IRS Ruling Against Harborside No Surprise by: Mark Pedersen
What has happened to Harborside, though regrettable and terribly tragic for those patients that rely on it, is far from being a surprise. The fact is, the only thing that has kept the state and Federal Governments from locking down ALL of the dispensaries in Cali and the other states with cannabis programs has been the sheer number of participants in their medical cannabis programs.
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MCJ Interviews Mary Lynn Mathre
I have been a registered Nurse for over 35 years. I began in medical/surgical adult care - nursing and the hospital system. Along the way, I learned about patients using cannabis. I have a Masters prepared background in medical/surgical nursing. In the early 80’s, I was a supervising nurse in a small hospital in Washington State. Our Director of Nursing was quite concerned because an elderly patient was coming in with what she called a “marijuana pill.
IRS Ruling Against Harborside No Surprise by: Mark Pedersen
What has happened to Harborside, though regrettable and terribly tragic for those patients that rely on it, is far from being a surprise. The fact is, the only thing that has kept the state and Federal Governments from locking down ALL of the dispensaries in Cali and the other states with cannabis programs has been the sheer number of participants in their medical cannabis programs.
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